A Chronological timeline of the events relating to the murder of Rhys Jones.
We’ll list any developments in the case and feature a chronological timeline of various news articles and police statements to help us understand what is going on.
We can fill in the gaps as people include links to any articles of note or any official statements. If you find a relevant article, copy the headline and a few paragraphs and make a link to the article.
For anyone who has information, please, for Gods sake, do the right thing.
Call Merseyside Police on 0800 230 0600, or Crimestoppers on 0800 555111; text the word Crime to 61051 followed by the information, or e-mail the Murder Investigation Team at murder@merseyside.police.uk.
Images below taken from the Norris Green and Croxteth gang videos.
It is almost 4 weeks since the murder of Rhys Jones, and the silence from the local community is deafening.
Those who know the identity of the killer are many, but not one has come forward. The killer’s name has been written in graffiti in Croxteth and reported online.
The law itself is failing the local communities by allowing gangsters, known by one and all, to establish themselves as legitimate. These gangsters act as role models for the young kids who then patrol the streets with the power of death over life in their hands.
The very idea that ‘human rights’ should extend to the creatures who predate on our communities, is insane and needs delegating to the wastepaper basket resting place of ‘useless ideas we all once had’.
A Reward for information leading to the capture of the killer of Rhys Jones.
The only mention of a reward for information leading to the capture of the killer was from the Sun newspaper, which is an insult to the city and is therefore a useless reward no-one can actually publicise.
The Sun newspaper, still held in contempt for their role in the Hillsborough Football Disaster cover up of 1989 - is a vulture like entity, looking to use the murder of Rhys as way to get the sales up and raise the advertising revenue.
Make no mistake; valuable time has been lost whereby the murderous pieces of cowardly trash that covered up the murder Rhys will have got rid of forensic evidence. It’s not just one killer that needs to be arrested. A well publicised reward might have tipped one of the lads or a girl to point the finger at a time when the evidence was fresh.
What we need is for local businessmen and woman, to start a reward fund which can actually be advertised and put on posters in the communities.
If there is one loyalty that Liverpool’s gang members and criminal fraternity have, it is money. That’s what their entire corrupt lifestyle revolves around. Their wives and girl-friends also in many cases, turn a blind eye to how that money comes in. The mother of the killer of Rhys, maybe sisters, aunts, and a grandmother, they all know something. You can hide a gambling habit or maybe a little bit of weekend drug use – and robbery, but murder is a different thing.
Media news and statements over the murder so far.
The killer of Rhys might well have been grassed up 48 hrs after the murder, but here we, almost 4 weeks away from the actual event, and the police are still appealing for us, the public, to help find the killer.
So far, the police and other statements to the media are as follows….
22 August
Rhys is shot dead.
The following day a statement by the Chief Constable is issued….
“This 11-year-old boy lost his life while playing football. This is a quite senseless and awful crime and we can only imagine the heartache of the family.
“There is someone out there who knows who the killer is. We want the community’s help to turn that gunman in.”
“It is too early to say if this is related to the gang culture. However, we do know the victim was not involved in any criminal activity.”
By the 24th, a local councillor Croxteth councillor Rose Bailey states…
“This is absolute madness. It has sent shock waves throughout the community. The community must keep calm and stay together until we find out what happened.”
What does she mean ‘until we find out what happened’? A child is killed in your council ward, and you’re asking what’s happened?
Peter Jones, spokesman for Liverpool Chamber of Commerce’s Business Crime Direct points to computer games and violent movies.
“We think that youngsters have been desensitised by computer games and violent movies where you see characters being blown 40 foot up in the air and nothing happens to them.”
Trust me Peter, people don’t progress from Mortal Combat to then becoming involved in the supply of class a drugs and contact with guns. Rhys was not killed by some lone kid hooked on violent computer games. But, some QC would happily use that as a defence.
We’re clutching at straws. We need the killer caught and the Chamber of Commerce could have raised £100,000, which would have been publicised far and wide, unlike the Sun (scum) reward.
The Daily Post reports that…
“Police believe his killer, who remains at large, is just 13 to 15 years old.” - this is 2 days after the murder.
25th August
From the Daily Post….
“Figures suggest Liverpool’s gun crime record may actually be worse than London per head of population.
In 2006, fifteen people were shot dead in the capital, and another 15 from January to June this year – 30 people over a year and half, a shocking rate of 1.6 fatalities per month.”
Worse than London? This is very bad indeed. Little wonder half the luxury flats in Liverpool are empty. More here
Also on the 25th Aug Bob Wareing rightfully attacks Blair for creating the conditions which led to the death of Rhys. (more here
And the father of Madeleine McCann sent a message of support to the parents of Rhys.
26th August
From the Daily Post…
On the Croxteth Park estate, police are trying to find a woman who was seen pushing a pram near the scene shortly before Rhys was shot.
Detective Superintendent David Kelly, the senior investigating officer, said the woman could potentially be a key witness.
He said: “We know from our enquiries there was a woman pushing a pram minutes before Rhys was killed and we believe she will have passed within close proximity to the killer.”
He added: “I ask for this woman to come forward to speak to us, and provide any information, however trivial she might think it is.
“We need as much detail about this killer as possible and she may be a key witness.
“She is described as wearing white wide-legged trousers with a dark tunic style top, almost like a smock.
“She had dark hair, possibly tied back and was pushing a dark coloured pram at about 7.25pm.”
Mr Kelly said that the bike-riding teenager who killed Rhys emerged at the back of the Fir Tree pub from an estate behind the actual pub.
He said that the boy, thought to be between 13 and 15, cycled at the back of the pub for a few minutes before firing three bullets in Rhys’ direction - one of which he said passed through his neck.”
Also the 26th …
“Six suspects are in custody tonight being questioned by detectives hunting the killer of Rhys Jones.
The six - all teenagers, including two girls - are among 10 suspects arrested by Merseyside Police over the shooting- of the 11-year-old last Wednesday night. One was arrested at lunchtime today. (Also Daily Post)
From The Times…
Key witness traced in Rhys Jones murder inquiry
“Merseyside Police this afternoon confirmed they had traced and spoken to a woman considered a potentially key witness in the Rhys Jones murder inquiry.
A force spokesman said that a woman seen pushing a pram near the Fir Tree pub minutes before Rhys, 11, was killed has been spoken to by detectives, but did not release details of what she had told them.
The news came as police revealed another arrest in the investigation. A 15-year-old boy was arrested shortly after midday today bringing a total of six people in custody - they are two girls aged 15 and 18 and four males aged 15, 16 and two aged 19. Another 15-year-old boy was released earlier today on police bail.
Patricia Gallan, the Merseyside Assistant Chief Constable, said that today’s arrest and release of suspects were part of “a dynamic and fast-moving investigation”. More here
27th August
By this stage we have six people in custody on suspicion of murder, four males, one aged 16, one aged 15 and two aged 19, plus two girls aged 15 and 18.
Those who have been bailed by Merseyside police include an 18-year-old man and three boys, two aged 15 and one 14-year-old.
Jesse Jackson was in town to open the Liverpool Slavery museum, and had the following to say….
“I have been saddened to hear of the tragic death of the 11-year-old boy in Liverpool, and it further highlights the problem of how guns are glorified in youth culture. Also, we have an issue with inner cities lacking job opportunities, and guns and drugs stepping into the void.”
Another article in the Daily Post, widely reproduced and quoted from…
“Dean, Jamie and Peter are all members of the “Nogga Dogs” Gang, from Norris Green, in north Liverpool.
They are sworn enemies of the Croxteth Crew and, all aged 18, they wear their gang’s “uniform” – dark tracksuit bottoms with Reebok classic trainers and dark hoodie tops.
Dean said: “I’ve been in the Nogga Dogs for more than two years and I will swear on my life that Rhys kid was not offed by a Nogga.”
The three openly confessed that they are always armed with knives and air guns. But, more worryingly, they say they also have access to a “library” of about 20 guns that are hidden around Norris Green and available for use.
Dean said: “At weekends, we go grafting – mostly over the water on the Wirral and Sowey (Southport). That’s where we make our money for the week.
“We rob anything. Shops, phones, cash – muggings or robbing from shops. We go for whatever we can get and we’ll do just about anything to get it.
“We will go for teenagers who have a lot of readies and threaten them and they hand over money.” (more here)
So three criminals confess to having 20 guns, and being scum and one says….
“I’ve been in the Nogga Dogs for more than two years and I will swear on my life that Rhys kid was not offed by a Nogga.”
Oh, that’s ok then. If you say so. I mean, if you did kill Rhys, you’d obviously be upfront and tell the journalist “yes, we’re child killers now.”
Another police statement…
“Assistant Chief Constable Patricia Gallan, from Merseyside Police, thanked Tesco and the community for their help in the investigation and information that has led to arrests.
SHE said: “We have now made nine arrests in connection with Rhys’s death. This is a dynamic, fast-moving investigation.
“The information being fed into the Incident Room is a vitally important strand to this inquiry and we are keen to ensure that a steady stream of information continues to flow in to us.
“I’d like to thank Tesco for their support in renewing our appeal for information.”
(note, Rhys’s father works in Tesco.)
Tesco, backed by Merseyside Police, have produced thousands of leaflets and posters appealing for information.
Also…
“SIX teenagers arrested on suspicion of the murder of Rhys Jones remained in police custody last night but detectives would not say whether they had found the 11-year-old’s killer.” BBC
Later that day…
“Four people being questioned in connection with the murder of schoolboy Rhys Jones have been released without charge, while two more have been released on police bail, police said today.” (Daily Post)
28 August
The parents of Rhys Jones make a second video appeal for information on the whereabouts of his killer (more here)
And…
Rhys murder police seal off wood
Police hunting the killer of 11-year-old Rhys Jones have sealed off a section of woodland in Liverpool close to the scene where he was shot.
Dam Wood, between the Croxteth Park Estate and Croxteth, is being searched with dogs after a public tip-off.
Officers said they had received a steady stream of calls from the public following Rhys’s murder and are appealing for more witnesses to come forward.
Assistant Chief Constable Patricia Gallan, of Merseyside Police, said: “The important thing that we’ve always said is that we can put special measures in if you’re frightened about your identity becoming revealed, there are things that we can do that will assist and protect your identity.” More here
29 August
We are appealing once again for the community of Croxteth to come forward with any information about the murder of Rhys Jones. (Merseyside police, more here )
31 August
Assistant Chief Constable Patricia Gallan said: “Detectives have this morning arrested a further four people in connection with the ongoing investigation into the death of 11-year-old Rhys Jones.
“”Arrests made so far are based on consistent information from callers and round-the-clock inquiries by detectives.
“Whilst this inquiry progresses swiftly, it is very much part of a focused, clear and confident investigation strategy. All individuals arrested so far are absolutely critical to the inquiry.
“People are aware that we have described one individual firing a gun but, as with any offence, there are various stages and elements to it, such as where the gun came from and what occurred afterwards.
“When we have grounds to suspect people involved in any stage, they will be arrested in connection with this offence.””
Also from the Merseyside police website…
“Detectives investigating the murder of Rhys Jones have appealed for a caller to Crimestoppers to contact them directly.
They would like to speak to the person who called on August 24 who reported seeing a male on a mobile phone.” More here
31 August
Killer practically named in The Times.
“A teenager involved in the police investigation into the murder of Rhys Jones is a notorious figure in the community who has been linked to gun crime in the recent past, it has emerged.
He is said to be a leading member of the Croxteth Crew and is understood to patrol his gang’s patch on a black bicycle hidden behind a dark hoody pulled over a distinctive black cap. He was arrested this year on suspicion of attempted murder but was released without charge. More here
September 01
Rhys police plea to key witnesses
Police investigating the murder of 11-year-old Rhys Jones have re-appealed for two key witnesses to contact them.
Acting Det Supt Dave Kelly was keen to speak to a person who called Crimestoppers on 24 August and reported seeing a man on a mobile phone. More here
Sept 02
Rhys murder suspect ‘on gang hitlist’
The Times report that a teenager is being urged to give himself up for his own safety. Article written Abul Taher and Philip Cardy.
“A PRIME suspect in the murder of Rhys Jones, whose name is circulating on Merseyside, could be a target of rival gang members and was last night urged to turn himself in.
Detectives, who have nobody in custody this weekend, said that the young suspect was likely to be in “turmoil”. Rhys is believed to have been caught in the crossfire between two rival gangs: the Croxteth Crew and the Strand Gang, based in Norris Green.
Detectives have so far arrested and released 16 people. They say the investigation is “focused” and all those arrested have been critical to the inquiry.” More here
September 04
A 16-year-old boy arrested in connection with the murder of Merseyside youngster Rhys Jones has been released on police bail. BBC. More here
Sept 09th
Rhys’s killer ‘fired shot as initiation rite’
Abul Taher and Philip Cardy writing for The Times.
THE teenage gunman who killed Rhys Jones, the Liverpool schoolboy, may have fired the shots as part of an initiation rite to be promoted in his gang’s ranks, underworld sources have claimed.
The killer is said to have been a member of the Croxteth Crew for three years and to have been involved in some of its most violent skirmishes.
The source, who knows both the Croxteth Crew and the rival Strand Gang from Norris Green, said: “If the shooting had gone to plan, the lad would have risen up the ranks of the Croccies [Croxteth Crew]. He’s one of those characters who’s on the rise - he’s seen as a bit of a loose cannon.”
According to the source, the gunman - who detectives have said is aged between 13 and 15 - was targeting a member of a rival gang outside the Fir Tree pub, in Croxteth Park, Liverpool. (more here)
Another from Sept 09, from the Liverpool Daily Post
The Government today launched a £1 million crackdown on gun crime in four of the English cities which have suffered most from gangs.
Neighbourhoods Liverpool, London, Greater Manchester and Birmingham will be targeted for action including undercover operations and surveillance against gang members, heightened police visibility and the provision of safe houses for witnesses and victims.
Home Secretary Jacqui Smith this morning said that communities affected by gun gangs would “absolutely” notice a difference in their neighbourhoods over the autumn as a result of the launch of the Tackling Gangs Action Programme. (Note: the gangs in Liverpool alone must bring in £1,000,000 per day if you add up the legit/money-laundering revenues they have, let alone the drug cash.
September 11
From the Daily Post….
Fears grow as graffiti links Rhys Jones suspect
“A COUNCILLOR representing the community where Rhys Jones was shot is demanding swift action from police – who almost three weeks after the 11-year-old’s death have yet to bring a charge.
Cllr Phil Moffatt says residents of the Croxteth Park area are talking openly about a prime suspect whose name has now appeared on neighbourhood graffiti linking him to the shooting. It is also now widely understood locally that residents know who the intended target for the shooting was.
Despite 17 arrests, Merseyside Police have yet to charge anyone with the murder. Now residents say they fear gangs will take matters into their own hands.” More here
September 15th
Officers investigating the shooting of Rhys as he walked home from football practice on August 22 have arrested 17 people, but no-one has yet been charged. (Daily Post)
September 18th
The parents of Rhys Jones insisted they were confident that their son’s killer would be brought to justice, as they opened a playground at his primary school. (The Times)
19th September
Rhys mother in appeal to caller
The mother of murdered schoolboy Rhys Jones has urged a mystery caller who contacted police days after his killing to get back in touch.
Melanie Jones and her husband Stephen renewed their appeal for help to catch their son’s killer four weeks to the day after he was shot dead in Croxteth.
The couple said they faced a traumatic week with their son’s 12th birthday and their 20th wedding anniversary.
The police officer in charge of the investigation almost broke down as he underlined their appeal at the press conference at Merseyside police headquarters.
Det Supt Dave Kelly said: “Do the honourable thing and come forward.”
His voice breaking with emotion, he said: “I really, really can’t come to terms with what they’re going through.”
The officer said it was “only a matter of time” before the killer would be caught. More here
And….
“Crews from BBC’s Crimewatch programme are filming a reconstruction of the Fir Tree pub murder scene today and the programme is expected to be broadcast next week.”
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A list of other young people killed this year…
* January 25 - Jevon Henry, 18, stabbed to death in St John’s Wood, north London
* February 3 - James Andre Smartt-Ford, 16, shot dead at Streatham ice rink, south London
* February 6 - Michael Dosunmu, 15, fatally shot in his bed at his home in Peckham, south London
* February 14 - Billy Cox, 15, shot dead at home in Clapham, south London
* March 5 - Odwayne Anthony Barnes, 16, stabbed to death in Birmingham
* March 6 - Jason Spencer, 17, killed in knife attack in Nottingham
* March 14 - Kodjo Yenga, 16, stabbed to death in Hammersmith, west London
* March 17 - Adam Regis, 15, stabbed to death in Plaistow, east London
* April 6 Paul Erhahon, 14, stabbed to death in Leytonstone, east London
* May 1 - Kamilah Peniston, 12, dies in hospital after being shot in her home in Manchester
* May 18 - Dwaine Douglas, 18, stabbed to death in Thornton Heath, south London
* May 21 - Sam Brown, 16, stabbed to death in Blackpool
* June 19 - Sian Simpson, 18, stabbed to death in Croydon
* June 23 - Annaka Pinto, 17, shot dead in Tottenham, north London
* June 23 - Ben Hitchcock, 16, stabbed to death in Beckenham, south London
* June 26 - Martin Dinnegan, 14, stabbed in Islington, north London
* July 26 - Abukar Mahamud, 16, shot dead in Stockwell, south London
* August 22 - Rhys Jones, 11, shot dead in Croxteth, Liverpool
Sun gutter-rag reward
25th August
“The Sun newspaper has put up a £100,000 reward in the hope that it will lead to a vital new lead over Rhys’s death.
The cash is for anyone supplying new information directly leading to the arrest and conviction of whoever was responsible for the murder and money will be paid at the discretion of the editor and Merseyside Police.”
Are Merseyside police aware that involving the Sun is controversial?
Furthermore, would a reward off Liverpool’s business community or some philanthropist such as Paul McCartney not be better?
Otherwise the killer is likely to be killed for the reported £50,000 put up by some of Liverpool’s less savoury characters.
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/09/381103.html
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/liverpool/2007/08/379900.html
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/09/380817.html
https://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/08/379740.html?c=on
https://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/08/379521.html
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/manchester/2006/09/349910.html
tried uploading a long story 4 times and no page change.something wrong with your site?
This story,sadly predicts the death of a child by the gangs.
The Liverpool Echo finally published the story today about the memorial of flowers adorning every post along the Strand of Norris Greens Scargreen avenue.I suspect only because a local historian felt it was so historical he paid for it to be photographed.But what they did’nt publish was the feeling of the local people about the tension in the air.Liam Smith,who its said was the leader of the Strand crew.is sadly missed.There can be no doubt of that.The young men and boys who make up this gang are grief stricken and very angry.The local ordinary folk of Croxteth and Norris Green are aware that something is going to blow.And so are the police.
But what have the police done?To all intents and purpose as far as the people of the two areas can see not much.The police say unless the community come forward with information there is little they can do.But if these two gangs were cells of terrorists what would they do then?You can bet your bottom dollar every mobile phone in the area would have it’s traffic monitored.Homes and cars would be bugged.Surveilence would be 24/7.
In short all the resourses of MI5 and MI6 and the national crime unit and anti terrorist squad would have the the guns and gunmen in custody and on charges that could put them in guantanamo befor a month went by.So by what definition is gun terror classed as crime and not as terrorism?Only in a legal definition.To the worried and frightend people of Croxteth and Norris Green it looks,feels and is terrorism.They say its only a matter of time till someone innocent gets shot and killed.And they are right and like in Manchesters Mossside it will probably be a child.Perhaps it’s time the police classed this kind of gun crime as terrorism and went after it with those resources.
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2006/09/350664.html
The police fiddle while children are killed.
From The Times, Aug 26 2007
Minette Marrin
It is no exaggeration to say that today’s children have been betrayed by today’s adults. The killing of 11-year-old Rhys Jones in Liverpool is a direct consequence of a mass abdication of responsibility by the generations that should have been protecting him – and his murderer, too.
I am not talking about Rhys’s grieving mother and father, who are loving parents of the sort every child should have. I mean the agencies of state, from police officers and local authorities to those in Whitehall and Westminster who have turned their backs on adult obligations and discouraged the rest of us from taking them on.
Although we are the most spied-upon nation in Europe and although we have spent billions on social renewal schemes, we have reached a state in which children and teenagers in big cities live in terror of other children and teenagers and in despair of protection from adults. They carry knives because they are afraid.
They are afraid on their way to and from school and they learn almost nothing when they get there, partly because adults don’t protect them from bullying, thieving and disruption. Teachers have either lost or relinquished their authority and children can expect little or no guidance and protection from them, or from their parents, or from council care, or from the police.
More here
From The Kirkby Times, 2003.
Rhys is not the only schoolboy to be shot by a weapon. Someone left a stash of guns out for the local kids in Toxteth to play with back in 2002. The inevitable happened and a shot was fired….
Guns and Drugs
Some of the shootings in 2003 which led us to the current situation…
On Tues Jan 8th there was another double shooting, this time in Croxteth. Two men from Toxteth were blasted by a shotgun as they sat in a car.
Ray Craven, 27, was shot dead in another execution style shooting in the Thatched House pub in Liverpool.
In 2001, Francis Gemmel an unemployed bouncer shot his ex girlfriend in the face in front of her three young children before turning the gun on himself.
On Tues Jan 8th there was another double shooting, this time in Croxteth. Two men from Toxteth were blasted by a shotgun as they sat in a car.
In July 2002, a Liverpool schoolboy was fighting for his life after being shot through the throat near a stash of dumped guns which were found in an alleyway in Toxteth.
Police discovered a semi-automatic pistol, three revolvers and a sawn-off shotgun nearby.
The schoolboy was said at the time to be paralysed for life after a weapon was discharged by a friend.
The Police themselves shot a man in July, he was said to have been brandishing a gun on the Motorway. Luckily, he only received a gun shot to the leg, unlike Liverpool man Andrew Kernan (Rest in Peace), a schizophrenic who was shot dead by Merseyside Police in 2001.
Where are the guns coming from?
From the Guardian (2007)
“Sitting outside a Cafe Rouge in north London one afternoon last May, undercover police saw for themselves how east European handguns can fall into the hands of the capital’s teenage gangs. Chatting over their lattes, Tony Magee, and Gerry Smith, two London criminals, negotiated the purchase of a consignment of weapons from Evaldas Cinga, a small-time Lithuanian arms dealer.
When police moved in, they found that Cinga had sold 18 Baikal IZH-79s pistols to the pair. Each came with a silencer and 20 rounds of ammunition. Banking records showed that Smith had transferred around £2,500 to Lithuania before his arrest.”
More here
Rhys Jones’s killer caught on CCTV
By Jasper Copping and Adam Lusher, Sunday Telegraph
Last Updated: 1:42am BST 26/08/2007…
“As Rhys’s mother wept uncontrollably at his beloved Goodison Park yesterday, where 40,000 football fans applauded the young Everton supporter’s life, a police source said: “There is a picture of the suspect.
Officers are working frantically to enhance the image which could provide a vital breakthrough in a case so far hindered by a wall of silence on Liverpool estates where people fear revenge attacks if they speak out.”
More here
Question….
IF this CCTV image exists - even if its blurred and might seem unrecognisable, do the police not have a duty to release it?
Come to think of it - have ANY attempts been made to release images of gun clutching youths from Norris Green and Croxteth caught on video?
A series of old fashioned ‘wanted posters’ - or is that not politically correct today? (i.e upset the offender)
I gave police the name of Rhys ‘killer’ but was not interviewed says pub landlord
Telegraph published this headline - and if you scroll down halfway on This page you will see the headline, but no actual reference to the interview which was conducted.
More on the CCTV also from the Telegraph…
“Mr Kelly said CCTV cameras at the back of the pub had helped his officers put together a timeline of the movements of the gunman before and after the shooting.
He revealed footage shows the killer riding up to the back of the pub, from an alleyway at it’s right-handside, at 7.27pm. He then disappears off camera, perhaps down another pathway directly at the back of the pub, before reappearing again at 7.29pm.
Mr Kelly said there was no footage of the shooting itself and that the gun was not captured on CCTV.
But the gunman is thought to have cycled down the side of the pub to the front, before firing three shots, one of them fatally injuring Rhys.
He then retraces his route and is captured on camera again, at 7.30pm, cycling down the right-hand path and making good his escape.
Rhys was standing at least 50 yards away from the killer when he was shot, Mr Kelly added.
“The three shots were fired and the gunman was away within 30 seconds,” he said.
“He’s not hesitated, he has gone with the deliberate intention of discharging the bullets and then got quickly away.”
Mr Kelly said that while there was no firm evidence, he could not rule out that he had acted with an accomplice or a “spotter.”
Detective Superintendent David Kelly. More here
Strange 3 shots fired and no sign of the bullets.
The story from timesonline is a good one.If the cops can’t or won’t do their job then the day will come when we all have to do it for them.I know that would be lawlessness against lawlessness.If the cops thought a mob was going to get the killer they would arrest him for his own protection.In London in the 1800’s the the mob often got to a villain befor the cops.Or they often accompanied the cops.As for the suns reward no further comment.But can we organise one ouselves.Admin could open an account.I would be happy to contrbute to it.And I would be happy to post it over the web to get donations to it.I’m sure the city’s business men would then contrbute,shame they have’t.It would be a news story for the mainstream media,who I have a number of contacts with.The publicity on such a story of a local few people organising it becase no one else has offered one would stir the population to donate.I’m sure of it.
Rhys Jones’ parents: Our darkest days are yet to come
Sep 20 2007 by Ben Rossington, Liverpool Echo
THE heartbroken parents of Rhys Jones will face two traumatic days next week with their 20th wedding anniversary followed by what would have been their son’s 12th birthday.
“We’re just keeping strong for each other but we need public support to bring this injustice to a close.”
More here
Reward for information leading to the capture of the killer of Rhys Jones
An Appeal to the good people of Liverpool
We’ve got a fund going to build a community centre, but we need to catch this murderous young man who shot Rhys - not least because he’s killed once and is liable to do it again if he gets away with it.
I wonder if the government has not pushed the idea of building a community centre to stop a genuine Scouse reaction, such as set up OUR reward.
Take away our initiative? Allow Murdoch to step in?
What we need some local business to kick start a Scousers Reward - not the filthy money of the Sun (scum) gutter-rag.
The silence is deafening from local landlords, the big club owners (such as Cream) and entertainment industry stalwarts such as McCartney or some of these DJs and so on - we need a known household name to set up the fund - it’s too big a thing for us at a humble local website to take onboard.
IF a trusted source opened up an account for the reward only, there could be a cut -off point if gets beyond £100,000.
The excess could go to the Rhys Jones Memorial Fund or all of it IF the killer is caught by other means - or someone just waives the reward because the reward would be the parents of Rhys thanking them.
Make no mistake - if this kid is not shopped soon, the police will probably be investigating another shooting.
400 residents from Croxteth Park packed the public meeting at Emmaus Primary School
Latest Update 22 September
From the BBC… More here
“Residents in the area of Liverpool where 11-year-old Rhys Jones was shot have been meeting police to discuss ways of tackling crime on the estate.
More than 400 residents from Croxteth Park packed the public meeting at Emmaus Primary School on Saturday.
Merseyside Police held a question and answer session about policing in the area, though they did not talk about the ongoing murder investigation.
From Monday, a permanent mobile police station is to be put on the estate.
Rhys was walking home from football practice through the Fir Tree pub car park on the evening of 22 August when he was shot.”
One VERY interesting fact about the visible police presence has been that there have been NO burglaries in the area.
Quote “A measure of the impact of the presence was revealed by the BBC’s Danny Savage, who said officers told the meeting there had been no burglaries in the area since 22 August.”
So it’s true, more police = less crime.
Also of note was this excerpt from the BBC…
“One resident received a round of applause when he stood up and said he was not surprised by the killing.
The man, who did not give his name, said anti-social behaviour had been a problem on the estate for some time, with people intimidated and afraid to visit the local shops near where Rhys was killed.”
One notable thing about the meeting was that the police never spoke about the murder itself.
But a resident was applauded when he broached the subject.
Previous shooting incident near were Rhys was murdered
The area around the Fir Tree pub was made a “designated area” by police last year, 2006. In June 2005 a number of youths were actually shot near the Fir Tree close to where Rhys was killed. It took the council several months to come up with the idea of setting up a ‘designated area’. Whenever you hear of a ‘designated area’ you know that a few more policemen patrolling the area would be a better idea.
Fighting for the territory
Norris Green and Croxteth have seen a growing gang/territorial dispute which has built up into a deadly rivalry which is highlighted in a series of videos and threats on YouTube and other ‘social networking’ websites.
We’ve had gangs in Liverpool for decades, centuries in fact, but it was the 20th century drug trade which poured hundreds of millions of pounds, per annum, into what was just the usual territorial urinating boundaries of young working class males who might push and shove each other here and there.
The inter-school fights, many of us have been through now continue on after the school-leaving years as the territories are now defined by drug gangs and mafias.
Prizes of millions of pounds are there for the taking. This is why bullets periodically fly and ht someone innocent. This is why there are so many guns here in the first place.
The police have had to be based in some local schools when trouble periodically breaks out.
Even primary school kids, in some areas of Liverpool, attempted to copy the behaviour of the older kids by trying to organise their own fights.
This was a clear sign that all is not well.
We chose to ignore it, and so Rhys paid the price for the problems we allowed to build up.
Murders of Danny McDonald and Liam Smith
To shed light on the recent gun toting history of Croxteth and Norris Green, we go back at first to the demise of the former ‘leader’ of the Croxteth gang who was shot dead on New Year’s Day 2004.
Danny McDonald was celebrating New Year’s Day in a pub, until a masked man walked in, pulled out a hand gun, and fired four shots into him. Another man was shot in the stomach as shocked customers looked on.
The next fatality was Liam ‘Smigger’ Smith, the 19 yr old leader of the Norris Green gang. He visited his mates in Altcourse prison on Aug 23 2006, and had a verbal altercation in the visiting room with members of the Croxteth gang. A phone call was made on a contraband mobile phone inside the jail, summoning the lads from Croxteth to take a short drive up and put a shotgun to Smigger’s head.
“Not about drugs or money”
The Liverpool Echo stated that the murder of Rhys Jones ‘was not about drugs or money’. Given that we’ve not even charged anyone and had the chance to look at the people involved in covering up the murder, it’s a bit of bold statement to make.
Almost everyone who actually owns an illegal gun in Liverpool is connected to drugs and money which has come from drugs. The children, who can get hold of guns, will usually always be going through someone connected to the drug trade.
People who sell guns rely on the drug trade for customers.
The police generally connect most of their gun discoveries to drugs.
Question - was the murder of Danny McDonald solved?
Hundreds of dealers selling heroin and crack working their beats in Liverpool often need access to a gun just to prove to rival gangs or up and coming rivals in the ranks that they mean business.
These patches are guarded jealously, and that means a few stray bullets from time to time.
For every bullet fired – there are a few hundred stabbings, baseball bat attacks and other mob handed incidents. Few are reported as gang related violence in the local papers, even when horrific attacks occur.
Most gangsters, though they might cry crocodile tears over Rhys, are not going to hand their guns in. Nor will they stop selling them or handing them over to the younger kids/teenagers who work for the drug trade.
You cannot run the drug trade, prostitution and racketeering under Queensbury rules. Murder, even child murder to some degree, (hit and run, stray bullets and so on) is accepted.
Rhys Jones obviously had nothing to do with drugs or money, but not so for those who are covering up this death and those who choose to keep silent.
Life on Mars on Merseyside
Part 1
“I will, to the best of my power, cause the peace to be kept and preserved and prevent all offences against people and property; and that while I continue to hold the said office I will to the best of my skill and knowledge discharge all the duties thereof faithfully according to law.” UK Police Oath.
Before young Rhys was born, the conditions were being established in the local communities whereby the use of guns was already part of the gang culture. It was always on the cards that innocent casualties would occur once the class a drugs came onto the scene.
The Tory Government pushed for and won two royal pardons in 1996 for two notorious drug dealers/arms dealers in Liverpool. The Home Secretary of the day, Michael Howard, did the honours.
Few people can work out why the only royal pardons issued in the UK to prisoners in recent times were given to people smuggling heroin and planting arms and explosives around the city.
This move gave untold confidence to the gangs here and made the entire judicial system look like a joke at a time when it really needed to flex some muscle.
Back in the days of the Tory government (and under new labour) we had a number of police working for drug syndicates, feeding intelligence to the local gangs and small discreet cliques that fly under radar bringing in a few kilos of gear now and again.
If the police are just human beings like everyone else (and they are) then it only stands that some will fall to temptation unless a system of careful checks and balances is set up and adhered towards.
Life on Mars on Merseyside
Part 2
In the insane days of the 80s when heroin poured into working class estates, crime went up so much that the police clear up rates were grinding to a halt. A ‘new’ crime was in town and the resources were not there to cope with it.
One example of corrupt police working with gangs, who had already shot their way into infamy, was Detective Chief Inspector Elmore Davies, second in command of the drug squad in Merseyside. He was given a paltry five years for corruption and perverting the course of justice as he sold information to Curtis Warren*, supposedly one of the richest dealers in the UK.
(*still in jail awaiting the trial [if any] for the matter of £300,000 worth of pot landing on Jersey in June 2007 - pot which he allegedly bought off a Dutch informant)
Elmore was nicked back in 1998 but he plays his part in the death of Rhys if we trace back the emergence of the gangs and chaotic situation which allowed them to put down roots.
Elmore Davies played a small walk on part that created the seeds for the chaos to come. Other areas of the UK saw sweetheart deals with cops and dealers. Some of the most dangerous criminals to have been on the wrong side of a prison wall were working as ‘informants’.
Councils, true to form, buried their heads in the sand as a tidal wave of crime started to rise up to our necks. ‘Experts’ came to the fore, pushing strange notions such as ‘no punishment for the wicked’.
The government itself seemed almost happy to let the class a filth flood into the streets of the UK.
Life on Mars on Merseyside
Part 3 final
PC Greg O’Leary was another Merseyside police officer caught red handed selling information to drug gangs back in 2004.
He was a PC for 21 years which makes you wonder when it was that he ‘turned’ or whether he was just kidding when he took his police oath.
He was jailed for only three and a half years, despite having made an estimated £80,000 by using police computers to search out information which he sold on to gangsters.
The Professional Standards Unit sniffed out this fly in the Merseyside Police ointment.
In a twist of fate, PC Greg was caught after surveillance was placed on the home of one Pc Mark Mitchell, who actually mentored O’Leary when he first joined the force.
Mitchell, the last sort of mentor any fresh faced plod might need, was also involved in criminal activity. PC Mitchell, who was retired, copped two years and 11 months after pleading guilty to conspiracy to corruption. In most cases when police are found guilty of corruption, the long serving officers still have the cushion of a nice pension, paid for by the public.
The police stated that PC Greg O’Leary’s criminal behaviour…
“was despicable and completely unacceptable and in some instances he put police officers lives at risk, which is a betrayal of the worst kind”
PC Greg was comfortable in selling the details of witnesses and fellow police officers, to anyone who had a spare £1000.
Though the betrayal to fellow police officers was despicable it was not the worse betrayal, which was to the city itself and to the children of the city.
In Merseyside back in 1995, Sir James Sharples, then chief constable, quietly disbanded the entire drug squad and serious crime squad. This was not because of a few coppers taking a doughnut or two. In fact, no real details were given on what exactly was going on.
The Telegraph reported that in the year 1995 ….
“more than 30 Home Office-approved telephone surveillance warrants were also issued - many of them for police officers’ domestic phones.” (Merseyside police officers phones)
Of course, to balance the matter a little, we have to bear in mind that the police in Merseyside today are making efforts to root out bent cops. Some police, a very small minority might well be corrupt, but every gangster is actively corrupt, always looking for the opportunity to relieve someone of their money or property or even their very lives.
A copper at least has rules which, if adhered to, keep him or her out of trouble and serving a useful purpose. The rules of gangsters are a different kettle of fish. In some ways their own harsh interpretation of justice, is the medicine they need.
Merseyside police unsolved murders.
In a recent survey of unsolved murders, Merseyside Police Force was the only major metropolitan force to withhold the figures. (source, the Daily Telegraph)
It is noticeable that the police website does not even have some basic system whereby all outstanding murders can be listed and the circumstances and clues outlined in the hope that these murders can be solved.
There are unsolved murders here in Liverpool and Merseyside which are not even reported online.
That would be John Hass, matter of public record.First involved with a Turkish heroin ring and sentenced.Then released as he had been part of the investigation,so it went.Cops reckon he is the source for most guns on the streets of Liverpool,again public record.As for bent high up cops.There was another in 1980 Inspector Brian Wiley,who if what i’m told is accurate,he was part of a previous trial involving Hass as a co-defendent at Manchester Crown for a string of armed robbery’s.One of the reasons peopple in Norris Green are afraid to go to the cops is they think some of them are with the gangsters at some level.One person I know said her son is often stopped by a couple of cops after his pot,for their own use.People in Norris Green are deeply suspicious of them so it’s no wonder story’s like that circulate.If anyone listened to Return To Norris Green you will see the comebacks from the gang members if you dare go to the cops,and the lack of a proper responce by them.As you say there are bad apples in every barrel,it’s human nature.
About Curtis Warren.From someone who went from a painter and decorator almost overnight to one of the biggest drug smugglers of all time must have taken intelligence and very big contacts.In the early days he was seen with a man,thats how it was said or that guy.No one ever knew who he was.So you get someone who gets locked up down to mobile calls.Then while he’s locked up he gets done again from mobile calls?Does’nt ring right.Then within days of getting out he gets nicked for more drug smuggling.It stinks.But i’m not defending him.My point is when the one’s on high decide they want you the law or your legal right or anything else means zilch.The cops know who killed Rhys.So why not apply the same rule to him and the rest of the scum?
Re: Curtis Warrens Jersey arrest - it does seem strange that he’d come out of a 12 yr stretch and promptly smuggle £300,000 worth of gear into an island known for harsh laws.
If he had no previous convictions, there might have been local support.
I agree with the police naming the killer - or allowing a newspaper to do so, if this is not sorted quickly.
We saw this with the murder of Steven Lawrence. The killers were not only named, they were on the front page and called murderers.
Young as the killer might be, he came of age when he pulled that trigger.
From, ’someone out there who cares’
Are you aware of the high number of children taking prescription drugs for depression or ADS? (attention deficit syndrome)
A number of murders in the US are being linked to children or young people using legal prescription drugs.
More here
(Ed: Good point - maybe the killer of Rhys is on some calming potion off the local GPs, who, I would venture, would not be as quick to prescribe these drugs to their own children.
As for ADS, many of us had that - but 2,3 of the strap got your attention.
Has anyone thought that Rhys was deliberetly targeted.?
Members of a rival gang may have been target of football fan Rhys’s killer
So says The Times in this article published 29 Aug…
“The gunman who murdered Rhys Jones may have been trying to shoot members of a rival gang who had strayed into “enemy territory”, it emerged last night.
Detectives are investigating whether the intended victims of last week’s fatal shooting in Liverpool were three gang members from the Norris Green area of the city. One of their close associates has told The Times that the trio were standing near a row of shops at the side of the Fir Tree pub in Croxteth Park when the hooded killer rode up on a BMX bike.
The gunman, said to be a member of a gang called the Croxteth Young Guns, fired three shots across the car park in their direction. Rhys, 11, who was walking through the car park on his way home from football practice, died after accidentally walking into the line of fire and being hit in the neck by one of the bullets.
One of the three Norris Green youths, all members of a gang known locally as the Nogga Dogs, is said to be the ex-boyfriend of an 18-year-old girl who was arrested on Saturday in connection with Rhys’s murder. She was later released without charge and is no longer being treated as a suspect.” More here
24 Sept
From the Liverpool Echo
“When asked about the progress of the search for Rhys’s killer, assistant chief constable Simon Byrne said: “It is not appropriate to start talking in detail at a public forum about that investigation.
“If someone is charged, and we’re confident that they will be, there is going to be a process and a trial. We can’t afford to corrupt that trial.
“We have top experts and specialists working on this particular case.
“But it is complex and we’ve got to get it right, so as soon as there is a breakthrough you will know about it, but you have to trust us on this one.”
The only way the police can win trust on this is to nick the killer.
Brown has said anyone over 18 found with a gun will get 5 years.That is allready part of the firearms act and has been for a number of years.
Why won’t police/media name the killer?
After all, they have already set a precedent….
The police say that it might endanger the trial, but they named the Anthony Walker killers 3 days after the murder by early evening of Mon Aug 1.
Anthony was attacked on July 29 2005 by two cowards who are not unlike hundreds of other lowlife out there.
Anthony died at 5.25am on July 30.
Merseyside police took the unusual step of naming Taylor and Barton as suspects. They did so because it was looking like someone would do their job for them and like the Rhys Jones murder, the writing was on the wall with people knowing who was responsible. Names were given almost immediately.
The government gave the go-ahead for the public outing of suspects. No chief constable can make such a move without a ‘it’s ok, we’re with you’ from those up above. This is understandable but regrettable insomuch that the government is at odds with what the public actually want.
I think the step of naming Anthony Walker’s killers, a very unusual step, led to the killers knowing the game was up.
The community itself has not yet asked why this precedent of naming a suspect has not been duly applied in the case of the killer of Rhys Jones.
Another case of note was the Steven Lawrence murder inquiry (ongoing)in which a national newspaper named 5 men, and included photos, with the headline MURDERERS. This was in the Daily Mail, 14 February 1997.
Why can’t The Liverpool Echo and Daily Post, name the killer, and offer for him to sue the paper?
12 people name suspect in Rhys Jones murder
Sep 27 2007 by Alan Weston, Liverpool Daily Post
“DETECTIVES investigating the murder of 11-year-old Rhys Jones last night said there had been a “fantastic response” to their appeal on the BBC’s Crimewatch programme.
In particular, a key witness has now been traced – the woman driver of a red car who nearly ran over the teenage gunman as he fled the scene on his mountain bike, just seconds after firing the shots which killed Rhys in the Fir Tree pub car park, in Croxteth.”
Good news about the witness in the red car. Maybe she was out of town, and not aware? We’ll see.
More here
Purple Ribbons for Rhys
From the Echo, 28th September.
“A first batch of 150,000 ribbons has been produced for Liverpudlians to wear in solidarity against gun crime.
The purple ribbons represent a campaign on Merseyside demanding 1,000 more police officers for the region, a mandatory 10-year sentence for carrying a gun, more witness protection resources and better controls of firearms.”
10 years for carrying a gun? Who would argue? Apart from people with illegal firearms?
Detectives still a long way from solving Rhys case, experts say
From the Guardian 29 Sept…
“Police closing in on killer but need more witnesses
Fears wall of silence may be too difficult to break”
More here.
As The Sun gutter rag publishes the photo of one of the suspects in this conspiracy the Guardian takes a more tactful approach when they say…
“Police have a strong suspicion as to who the killer is and are trying to convert intelligence into evidence to have a watertight case to take to court and secure a conviction.”
Police apparently warned the Sun newspaper not to publish the photo and details.
Sent in by reader, from Daily Post 2006
“THE families of rival youth gang members have been invited to attend secret crisis meetings with Liverpool’s top police officers.
Escalating rivalry between the warring Norris Green and Croxteth gangs has already resulted in murder, attacks, verbal threats and homes being shot at over recent months.
On August 23, Liam Smith, a member of the Norris Green faction was shot in the head out-side Altcourse prison and died.
In a bid to end the mayhem, Merseyside police wrote to the families of suspected gang members urging them to help.
Earlier this week officers held two separate meetings with families at key locations in Croxteth and Norris Green.
Today, police said they were pleased with the response.
Inspector Louise Harrison said: “We had quite a few mums and dads turn up.”
Never quite worked though, did it
18th Arrest, gun found.
From the Liverpool Echo…
“POLICE believe they may have found the gun used to kill 11-year-old Rhys Jones.
They raided a house in Norris Green on Saturday and arrested a 16-year-old boy on suspicion of possessing a firearm.
He was questioned by the police team assembled to hunt for the schoolboy’s killer.
The boy, from Norris Green, was released on police bail pending further enquiries.
Today Merseyside police were remaining tight-lipped on the arrest and refused to confirm a weapon was found in the swoop.
But gang sources insist one was found and forensically tested.
Police said the arrest was the result of a one-off warrant and the boy was not questioned on suspicion of murder.
It is the 18th arrest in connection with the death of Rhys who was shot as he returned home from football practice in Croxteth Park.”
More here
The article ends with “A gang source told the ECHO: “The gun will have been kept at one particular address and not moved.”
Seems hard to believe that a gun used in a child murder would then be simply stashed away in ‘one of the lads’ homes. You have to err on the side of caution with this latest find.
But either way, its another idiot to incarcerate for ten years if we have our way.
If everyone in Liverpool who had access to a gun was imprisoned, we’d be a better city for it and make no mistake.
Get rid of it before your kids are telling you how school is, from the visiting room of a prison.
Get rid before you fire off a few shots only to find your headline news and see your future begin to crumble.
From the BBC today…
“A spokesman for Merseyside Police confirmed the boy had been arrested on Saturday for a suspected firearms offence and is now on bail.”
If he is on bail - its hardly likely to to be THE gun.
Come to think of it - why are people bailed IF a real gun is found? Surely that needs addressing?
Another quote from the BBC today…
“Police believe he (Rhys) was the innocent victim of a gangland feud and the killer had another target.”
So a squabble about drugs/who stepped on your foot and so on - is now pretty much a reason for known gangsters and their child employees to deem themselves judge, jury and executioner of our children?
If we don’t get this child murderer soon, its a bit like that song by the Manic Street Preachers…
“if you tolerate this, your children will be next.”
Inquest Resumes
From the BBC…
“Police investigating the death of 11-year-old Rhys Jones told his inquest they were pursuing several “positive lines” of inquiry.
A detective gave an update during the brief resumption of the inquest attended by the boy’s parents Melanie and Stephen Jones.
Acting Det Supt Dave Kelly from Merseyside Police also urged those closest to the killer to come forward.
The inquest was adjourned until the afternoon of 4 December.
Rhys was shot through the neck as he walked home from football training with two friends.”
Everyone knows who the youth is - his name has been written on walls - and his mother knows he is the killer.
Liverpools gang members pass it off as “it was a richochet, he never meant it - its unlucky - blah blah blah”
If this is left to the law to process it - the killer will get manslaughter IF the cops nail him.
10, 12 yrs?
I think he took a life so has to give his in return. We take his days of freedom and bring them to an end.
His choice is take the States punishment or take that of his peers and elders. The first is life in a cell - the second is a grim dire scenario which ends as suddenly as Rhys’s life ended.
The police should be on his case 24/7.
The local community should pressure the family and mates - if not we’ve lost and child murder is ‘ok’ and shooting off guns in public is ‘alright’.
Police appeal for bike used in murder
From the Liverpool Echo
“MURDER squad detectives believe an unsuspecting child could be riding round on the bike used by Rhys Jones’s teenage killer.
Police are still trying to track down the silver and black mountain bike two months after the 11-year-old was gunned down.
Detectives believe the gunman dumped the bike as he fled Croxteth Park.
They think another youngster then picked it up - not knowing it could provide crucial evidence to the murder inquiry team.”
Rhys witness comes forward
From the BBC…
“A potential witness has come forward after the Rhys Jones case was featured for a second time on BBC1’s Crimewatch.
The witness said he was in the car park in Croxteth, Liverpool, when the schoolboy, 11, was shot on 22 August.
The show renewed its appeal for a woman in a red car to come forward. Police believe she may have seen the killer.
Police thank community
For those who think we are all complicit in child murder…
Merseyside Police has today made a new appeal for a potential witness to come forward in the investigation into the murder of Rhys Jones.
Officers are wanting to speak to a young boy who was at the Fir Tree Public House approximately 15 minutes before the incident in which Rhys was killed. The boy was later seen at the vigil held at Croxteth Country Park.
Police making good progress
Assistant Chief Constable Patricia Gallan said: “We are continuing to make good progress with the investigation and are following a number of positive lines of inquiry.”
“Merseyside police would also like to thank the community for their help and support. Everyone who has come forward and everyone we have traced, who was present at the scene, has given a statement and assisted the investigation.”
That was from the police website 22 Oct.
Chief Constable Knows Rhys Killers name
From Liverpool Echo
“MERSEYSIDE’S top policeman knows the identity of Rhys Jones’s teenage killer.
Chief constable Bernard Hogan-Howe warned the teenage gunman, whose name is an open secret across much of Liverpool, his officers were building a case.
He said it may take time but officer will eventually snare their suspect.
The chief constable added: “We know who you are and we will get you.”
Rhys, 11, was shot as he walked home through Croxteth Park on August 22 after football practice.
He was hit by a ricocheting bullet in an attempted gang attack between feuding members of the Croxteth Crew and the Norris Green-based Strand Gang.”
Here’s the latest story.The named one is under the misguided belief that because he never aimed at Rhys he won’t get done for murder.Let me enlighten him.The court of appeal queens bench ruled that the intent to shoot A and missing him and hitting B was still murder.See Archbold,Maxwell Sweet.
The very fact that certain parties have slyly manipulated the forensic evidence, planned it advance obviously (they all do) then it’s not just a case of manslaughter.
Good point there Spit - he was out to murder someone - and he did. Who he aimed at and who actually died is immaterial as far as the sentence goes. He shot a child and ran away to leave him to die. Worse still, he shot the Jones family through the heart - and more besides. We’ve got to take this into account when sentencing him.
Liverpool offered him mercy, he decided to see if he get away with child murder imagining that the Crocky Eds are big enough to protect him.
Recent news of the gunfire up here kind of lays to rest the idea that anyone in the scene is safe. Unlike a game of chess - the kings go down here before the pawns.
He might, on the other hand, be thinking that he will squirm his way out of it - land some low sentence in the worst murder we’ve seen in Liverpool.
His first night in jail will be a memorable one. (if he makes it that far)Its bad enough for anyone first time - but for a known convicted child killer?
How many Scouser’s will buddy up with this candidate?
The lad also bought his sins down on his family or they bought theirs to him. They cannot remain in Croxteth, and the authorities can evict someone from their own home if needs be - even if they purchased it. (and have proof)
The killer loses his family name. He’ll be a no one when or if he comes out. His only hope is that 20 or 30 years changes him. Maybe if taken away from the environment he might somehow be able to pay back a tiny portion of what his debt now is in this life and on this Earth.
That’s all his life is now - paying back the debt. If he comes out aged 46 or 56, he will be a different person.
We just want him arrested and charged, jailed and for the Jones family to tell us that they feel some Justice has been done.
I notice you mention the name of Liverpools ex famous well known guy that failed to offer a reward.So heres something to wake him up.
To.
Paul McCartney.
Remember the letter we sent you re your involement in the Hollydays fraud?We take it you used us as the”2 liverpool gangsters” in your 2nd wife divorce, citing 2 Liverpool gangsters would deal with her?. Remember the letter from Knowsley Media Services?.Informing you we had evidence of your involvement in a VAT fraud?.We believe you used that letter and our phone calls as the so called Liverpool gangsters.We resent that.And bearing in mind we still hold your original recording we would like your reply.
You have 7 days to respond.or the whole of your own recording will be published in it’s entirety on this site,and others.
admin.
I need a postal address or way of contact to give you this tape.
doing certain search techniques i have established your initials are **.If it is ok with you I will leave said tape Post Restraunte with your full name on a given date.
I’ll email you over the tape.
Just remembered that one.
Have you still got a gun?
Maybe you should dump it before you kill a child - but you won’t will you? A plumber needs his tools and so do Liverpool dealers and racketeers. Nobody punches their way to the top these days, not in that game.
A ten year sentence for possession of a firearm will help a lot.
Add 5 years per bullet/shell and it would add more interest to the local courts.
We’ve heard the chat over this - now lets get the pens out and sign on the dotted line and make it legislation.
From the Echo…
“Four people have been arrested after guns and ammunition were discovered during police raids in Liverpool.
During the raid at Circular Road West, Norris Green officers recovered a handgun, two rifles and ammunition.
A 39-year-old woman, a 39-year-old man and a 16-year-old boy were arrested and questioned on suspicion of possession of firearms. They have all been bailed.
In another raid in Croxteth a 55-year-old man was held after a handgun and live ammunition were found.”
At what point do we offer a reward?
The Scum (Sun) gutter-rag jumped in like Flint to try and gain some moral credibility as the big paper that cares.
What we needed was someone honest to come forward and say “Here is £whatever”.
Over in Manchester the murder of Jesse James has seen a reward put up. Not much some might say - but £20,000 is a lot of cash.
From the BBC…
“Police investigating the murder of Manchester teenager Jessie James are pursuing a number of leads, following an appeal to catch his killers.
The 15-year-old was shot dead as he cycled through Moss Side in September.
Six months on, a £20,000 reward is being offered for information leading to the killer’s arrest and conviction.”
Jessies mum released a brave statement…
“Jessie’s blood is on the hands of the murderer, his accomplices, their families and their friends who knowingly uphold their actions and say nothing or do nothing.
“I will not rest until the perpetrators who have randomly massacred my son are eradicated from the streets of Manchester or wherever they have taken refuge.”
Jesse James cops failed to act on witness tip offs
BBC…
The shooting of Jesse is another sign of how the police lost vital time. The off duty officer who was told of the incident, never got in touch with his colleagues right away.
“The Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) made the call after investigating two incidents relating to how they responded to a tip-off.
The investigation centred on a sick off-duty police officer who failed to act on a phone call from a witness.
Jessie, 15, was gunned down in a park in Moss Side in September 2006.
The officer, who was suffering from a chest infection, was woken by a call at 0119 BST from a person who reported seeing a disturbance in Broadfield Park, where they had seen flashes and an individual fall to the ground.
But Greater Manchester Police initially maintained that the first call about the shooting was received at 0238 GMT - almost 80 minutes later.
The officer’s failure to act on the tip-off until 0830 BST amounted to a “failure of duty” according to the investigation which recommended the officer receive a written warning.”
End of BBC.
Although Merseyside police responded soon after the shooting and were informed of the killers name at the pub, you have to wonder when he was nicked and where he was for the period between murdering Rhys Jones and being arrested.
How did this evil piece of pond life escape the dragnet and manage to cleanse the ‘blood’ or the forensic evidence which pointed to the spilling of blood?
Where did he clean himself up?
He is obviously being protected by his fellow gangster mates and the family which spawned this wretch.
So child murder IS accepted here. Even when rat boy is finally dragged weeping into a cell - we will be tainted with that forever. My guess is the next child killed will be easier to cover up.
Plus, has anyone noticed the guns are just being pulled out in other areas by other people now?
I’ll take that as a yes.If your are ,who you deleted(**),which you need to confirm to me first.Then on a day to be informed of ,the said tape will be lodged.This is a very informative recording made by the said person himself,his wife says so to him on it,with a caution to that effect.I cannot make a mistake in giving this away.I need an absolute deliver.
Spit… Where can I download the .mp3 of the tape recording ?
:0o
FOONian.
This tape has never been published.It will be a world first on here.I am trying to get hold of an old tape to tape recorder to copy it.
here is a taster.Linda McCartney warns Liverpools most famouse that he is making this recording.
“Watch out honey your recording this”.
“Ringo came begging for money.I said I could close this company now.”.
That showed he had full control of Apple when he denied it.
This is a summary of John and Lee Eastman,Dad and brother of Linda.
Paul.
Whats this?
Lee.Thats l……………………….
Paul It never cost us nothing .We made it in a room in Scotland.
Lee YeahhhhIt’s stuff we pay off to the tax boys.
This make the one day released and deleted album “Hollydays a fiddle/
If you tie it into the death of wings singer and blackbird?
This is my 15 year old memory of the tape.But i can assure you it reads true to tape.It is 45 minutes long.
Edited by the Ed
Its not censorship Spit - we were just heading off into something that was best not here.
We’re both right and both wrong, on whatever it was.
Lets get back to single fire - but email me through the sites email addy and I’ll ’speak’ to whatever email you have.
Rhys Jones Inquest
Police making significant progress
From Liverpool Echo here.
DETECTIVES told Liverpool’s coroner they are making “significant progress” in the hunt for the killer of schoolboy Rhys Jones.
Before a short inquest hearing yesterday, Andre Rebello was given a private briefing by detectives on the progress of the investigation.
In open court, Mr Rebello said he was “pleased to see there has been significant progress and further lines of enquiry need clarifying” but stopped short of divulging what he was told.
Rhys’s parents Melanie and Stephen were at Liverpool coroner’s court for the hearing which lasted less than five minutes.
Rhys, 11, was shot dead as he walked through the car park of the Fir Tree Pub, in Fir Tree Drive South, on the Croxteth Park estate, on August 22.
From the Liverpool Echo…
“MERSEYSIDE’S gun criminals are having the sights turned on them in a new hard-hitting police crackdown.
The anti-gun, anti-gang Matrix squad plans to make life miserable for those at the top end of the gun crime ladder.
A hit-list of the key players has been drawn up, and police have promised they will get “very special attention”.
In a unique move, detectives will call on the criminals at home and give them a choice - lay down their arms and stop the shootings or face the full wrath of the police.”
Good idea. It’s what people have said all along.
But ‘full wrath of the police’ is not quite what we want - its the full wrath of the law. Still, its good to hear anyone speaking along the lines of ‘full wrath’. Better than the fancy Dan language of political correctness.
I think we’ve heard about the proposed 10 years for carrying an illegal firearm with obvious ill intent.
We only had to hear it the one time and most of us thought “seems fair to bang anyone up for ten years if they are tooled up with a gun”
All we need now is the idiot politicians to act.
Police think they have found gun that was used to kill Rhys Jones.
From the BBC…
“Detectives investigating the murder of Rhys Jones believe they have found the gun used to kill the 11-year-old.
Rhys was shot dead as he walked across a pub car park in Croxteth Park, Liverpool, six months ago.
Since then Merseyside Police officers have taken 108 guns off the streets, one of which they believe to be the murder weapon.”
If this is THE gun, then the police have done well. You would have thought that gun would be at the bottom of the Irish sea, but either way, lets hope we have got the murder weapon.
As they failed to locate any of the three bullets fired I can’t see how they can forensically link it to Rhys.But who knows if they never found any,it could be bogus info for their own reasons.Lets hope so.
Your right there mate - we don’t really know what the police have - but I think you’ll concede that whatever it is - we’re not going to know about it until the trial.
I know as much as the next CSI Crime show watcher - and would imagine you’d need a bullet to be 100% sure. But I’m sure that the bullet wound might leave traces of substances and a pattern linked to a specific firearm. There may be fragments also if not a bullet.
A specific gun might be matched up with the wound, after all, they will have tested that gun to see how it fires and could see what sort of wound it might cause at the distance it was fired.
The police are doing the best they can given the circumstances.
They are right not to let the politicians pressurise them into getting results. We all know that innocent people would be sent down if we went back to those days.
What gives the police the advantage is forensics and the new technology out there which is helping the police get better at murder investigations and other capers.
I’m sure every cop out there would love to feel the collar of this little rat.
His time will come.
On an aside - I really wonder if new lab have not put the boot into the police to warn them off investigating all those dirty bent councillors up and down the UK, who oversee chaos and line their pockets on land deals and contracts with baddies.
Less police = less chance of the lowlife at the top being collared.
We want Rhys Jones’ murderer locked up
From the Liverpool Echo, a report 6 months after the murder…
Six months after 11-year-old Rhys Jones was shot dead in Croxteth Park, Liza Williams and Laura Sharpe report on a community trying to recover from the shock of a child’s death, and the fact a killer has yet to be brought to justice
by Laura Sharpe
THE prime suspect’s name in the Rhys Jones murder case has been spray painted on walls, posted on internet sites and is spoken of by many Croxteth Park residents every day.
But six months to the day after the little boy was shot walking home from football practice, nobody has been charged for the crime, despite 17 arrests and CCTV of the suspected killer escaping the scene on a mountain bike.
On Wednesday, Merseyside Police confirmed the gun used in the murder had been found, and added the force is endeavouring to produce a watertight case.
However, many residents feel a sense of frustration that the killer is still on the loose.
Rest of article here.
How much have police spent protecting the child killer?
We hear that the police have put resources into protecting the suspect and family. Possibly police protection of sorts, which is pretty much a duty for the police. Panic line (it would be good if the old peoples homes had one, eh?)plus officers allocated to help the child killer thwart the same sort of justice he thought fit for a rival drug dealer.
The killers name and address were posted on our videos on YouTube.
The comments were taken off, but I’m sure other videos uploaded have no careful eye keeping watch for these sort of comments going up. His name and address is being published. We’ll see a photo soon. Perhaps video.
We cannot afford to let this killer or his helpers ever think that child murder is going to be tolerated in Liverpool.
As for the police protecting him, I guess Liverpool has forced the hand of the cops there.
Few people have had as many death threats as this one.
All we actually needed were the witnesses to come forward.
They failed the community more than the police force.
I see the daily Express have published the name of Rhys Jones Killer,be it via a googleit in the comments page.
Here.
You can find his name and address on a growing number of websites.
Comments such as “It was **** ****** who killed Rys and everybody knows”.
“I’m from croxteth and the killer is scumbag **** ******! Even the police know who he is!”
“welcome to Croxteth is there ANY kids with a brain in croxteth? … why dont you little sh*** give up that child murdering ba****d **** ******?”
“**** ****** will die!! > ******** said on 02-22-08 at 05:19: … its all over the net who shot Rhys, just google, **** ****** (address included) …”
“**** ****** = rhys’ killer. FULL STOP! leatharker | October 31, 2007 … Scum, Thats What, Shouldnt Be Breathin, Life For A Life” …
And so on…
BRING BACK 1. THE BELT 2. THE BIRCH 3. HANGING.
THE CRIMINALS ARE HAVING A LAUGH.
what are all the do gooders saying now?